Zune wireless: worthless (for now)

So throughout this whole Zune launch thing the whole lot of us have been playing cat and mouse with Microsoft on the finer points. Will it or won't it be built on PlaysForSure or some variant? How will it recognize copyrighted vs. creative commons content without opening up piracy loopholes? And perhaps most importantly: how will the wireless work? Well, it turns out that a Zune employee by the name of David Caulton thought it'd be worth putting together a cogent explanation of what the Zune wireless connection can and can't do.

You can:

• Can search for and find other Zunes nearby.
• Can send songs / albums for the 3 x 3 trial. Songs past the three days / listens are deleted at next sync, but catalogued on your PC for record-keeping should you want to purchase them later. No word on whether Microsoft is going to keep track of which files are traded.
• You can send and receive image files for "unlimited viewing." (Oh, so copyrighted images aren't worth DRMing?)

You can't:

• Connect to the internet.
• Download songs directly from the Zune store via WiFi.
• Sync to your computer via WiFi.

Sorry Microsoft, we think you have it backward. The killer app of having wireless in a portable media device isn't sharing DRMed files -- it's downloading music from a near infinitely large library no matter where you're at. That's why the MusicGremlin was and is so freaking cool. All the music, none of the bother with PCs. So to find out the Zune won't even match that device in terms of use for wireless is a little disappointing, to say the least. Granted this above is with regard to the feature list for launch (and Microsoft doesn't claim the Zune is feature-complete), so we can probably assume that we'll be expected to hold out for later Zune firmware releases where actually useful wireless capabilities will be added.

[David @ Oct 2nd 2006 7:57PM]

Another thing is that there are a lot of people who are interested in portable music players that already have an iPod. Zune really needs to be justifiable as an add-on purchase, and I just don't see these silly features as being worth the cost.

What is the reason that you can't sync up to a computer, just other Zune players? Is this a privacy concern? Some sort of business decision? Obviously, MS could implement this tech if it wanted to...right?

[milotti @ Oct 2nd 2006 7:59PM]

The 80GB iPod which is smaller than the Zune has up to 20hours of whenn fully charged of audio playback and 6.5 of video playback. I think this one should be compared.
And this pictures (http://www.jakeludington.com/zune/20061001_zune_and_ipod_photo_comparison.html) show us how ugly the Zune looks.

[tekdroid @ Oct 2nd 2006 8:11PM]

a Microsoft rep who chose to remain anonymouse said:

I'm gonna lose my job over this 3-listens-or-3-days social interaction BS! Look at what the punters are saying! God, I hope I'm still around for generation 2.

Still, I'm hopeful that the market responds to our useless features, as most Joe Users do. We should do well in the marketplace. This technical crowd doesn't loosen their pursestrings so easily. Thank god for Joe User! Look here, Joe, we have Wi-Fi! Our competitor doesn't! Yoo-hooo! Here!

[reddeth @ Oct 2nd 2006 8:32PM]

Damn that sucks! The only reason I personally had to buy one was the WiFI, I'll stick with a bigger iPod for the larger storage space...

Sorry MS, you are teh sux0rs...

[Lt_Ladle @ Oct 2nd 2006 9:07PM]

whatever happened to "live anywhere", where their goal was to extend the Live service so that you can pay them though the nose no matter where you are...remember? they said stuff like cellphone acess, PSP access, full integration. now this?

[Tom @ Oct 2nd 2006 10:14AM]

This is just another post written by someone who doesn't know all of Microsoft's plans... just because a feature wont be available from day one, doesn't mean that it wont come. It's probably being held back for technical or legal reasons.

No credit for "future features a/k/a vaporware" ... by the time MSFT gets around to enabling this feature on a broader basis:

1. Hardware will have moved forward enough that you'll want to replace the player anyway with something thinner/more featured.

2. Apple will have released at least one more generation of iPods, as will Sandisk, etc.

[K28 @ Oct 3rd 2006 12:49AM]

Ok, here is how i share my music with my frineds,

1) inseard cd/dvd-r (cd/dvd-rw in case i dont want to west cd-r).
2) burn the entier iTunes libary, or just an album or tracks my friend want.
3) give it to my frined.

Oh, "I want only that song that" -> "cool I email it to you tonight"

[Bernard @ Oct 3rd 2006 5:10AM]

@Frank

MP3 players dead? Give me a break... Orb's quality is terrible (it's a RealMedia stream), and until we live in a world with ubiquitous (and free) WiFi I don't think Apple/Microsoft have much to worry about.

@lUp

I imagine the battery life on the Nokia N95 is going to be approximately 25 minutes when you're playing music (and probably about 10 seconds if using GPS) which will be handy when you need to make a call... I've got an N80 and it lasts about a day between charges, and that's without playing any music on it.

[Zune-Online.com @ Oct 3rd 2006 9:14AM]

As Posted in Cesar Menendez blog (Zune team member in Microsoft) Posted on September 19, 2006:

(You can find this on www.zuneinsider.com)
---
I misspoke (mis-blogged) on last week�s post. We don�t actually �wrap all songs up in DRM:� Zune to Zune Sharing doesn�t change the DRM on a song, and it doesn�t impose DRM restrictions on any files that are unprotected. If you have a song - say that you got �free and clear� - Zune to Zune Sharing won�t apply any DRM to that song.
---

So there is NO such a thing as adding DRM protection to unprotected MUSIC files.

I think this should be clear by now in engadget.

-- Zune-Online.com

[Mantari Damacy @ Oct 3rd 2006 9:21AM]

YOU DON'T KNOW THE HISTORY OF MICROSOFT. I DO.

The release version 1.0 of a product. It is really crappy and lacks all sorts of functionality that you would expect. But they get their foot out there and listen to ideas. They take some of those ideas and add it into v2.0. A bit better. They add what should have been in their initial release and make it v3.0. Good. Then they start adding in features and with version 4.0 on, you've got a solid product. So, yes, the article is correct. Zune v1.0? Forget it. Wait for the later versions which actually do something. That's the Microsoft way.

[Timothy @ Oct 3rd 2006 10:14AM]

Why would Microsoft be interested in designing Zune such that it cuts out the PC? Microsoft has every interest to make sure Zune is thoroughly dependent on a (Windows-based) PC for its care and feeding. Sensible WiFi functionality would undermine that objective.

This is not a missing feature. It's working as designed.

[mehtadone @ Oct 3rd 2006 10:38AM]

What will be good is when the reverse engineers get hold of the device! I can imagine something like Rockbox being awesome on it especially if the wireless hardware is cracked. I'm sure it will take some time though. I can't see the Zune avoiding it. All the "big" gadgets have had some bashing, the PSP, XBox, Ipod etc

[gWHEEdoh @ Oct 3rd 2006 11:14AM]

I've decided I would like a Zune for a couple of reasons.

#1, I wanna watch Hackers on it endlessly and see how many people I can annoy at work. I'll use clever catch phrases and up to date terminology like, "RISC is good," and of course: "I'll HACK THE GIBSON!"

#2 When people finally get all pissed of at me and decide they want to beat me to death, I'll have a fighting chance when swinging my Zune at them. I wonder if the Coroner would declare it a "blunt object" and also if the Zune is impact resistant enough .... Ahem.

#3 I already forgot.. I mean

On a serious note... Someone mentioned that this devices sound quality is going to determine its fate. I think it's video quality too will be a factor.
Thanks for the entertaining blogging.

[Mike @ Oct 3rd 2006 11:29AM]

Zune in V2 has a tremendous capability of being a killer dating tool with its Wifi feature. This will be HOT among teenagers. Imagine going to school and seeing on you Zune that there is a girl that digs you.

[h0mi @ Oct 3rd 2006 12:57PM]

The trial for shared files (3x3) would be better if it were longer- unlimited plays for a week, or something along those lines. It doesn't need to be open forever

[Ian McKinnon @ Oct 3rd 2006 12:59PM]

Wow!!!!! I must say Zune is really impressive... Useless WiFi and it still plays DRM music???

I was just sitting here looking at my Palm TX thinking about how it too can play music, has real wireless and bluetooth for syncing to my laptop AND that I can go online with it to download music... Plus I can read E-Books, watch movies and see pictures etc...

It looks like MS has a ways to go to compete with a product that I bought that is not even a PocketPC...

I.M.
UC Davis

[kcpaul @ Oct 3rd 2006 1:46PM]

Uh, people. It's guerrilla marketing, not "gorilla" marketing.

[David_T @ Oct 4th 2006 10:06AM]

"Uh, people. It's guerrilla marketing, not "gorilla" marketing"

No, when it's that obvious, it's definately gorilla marketing.

[Philip Wesley @ Oct 3rd 2006 4:15PM]

I think the Zune isn't for me right now. I'm happy with my 60GB iPod and I do not have any real room for another MP3 Player at this moment. The wireless features also do not interest me at this moment.

[John Papola @ Oct 3rd 2006 5:56PM]

Microsoft has such contempt for consumers it's sad, though not nearly as sad as all the delusional iPod/Apple bashers excited about the Zune. This whole "Microsoft Points" system for the Zune store and Xbox live is the most blatant attempt at tricking consumers I've ever seen. Why aren't the points a 1-to-1 ratio? How did they decide 79 points = 99 cents? I'll tell you... because they're hoping you get confused and over time come to think of points as being equal to dollars. And they're right, because many users will. This is just about theft.

And the mechanism for buying points in bulk is even more repulsive. Having "left over" points waiting to be used is the equivolent of giving Microsoft a zero interest loan.

I find it bizarre that people refer to Steve Jobs and his direct, plain style explanation as a "reality distortion field" while every boob that opens his mouth from Microsoft spews the most repulsive marketing double speak the world has ever heard.

Zune and Microsoft are in it to trick you and lock you to Windows and draconian DRM. Don't be a fool.

[Ricky @ Oct 3rd 2006 8:47PM]

Someone said this earlier, I believe, on page one, but it bears repeating. The same dude that ran the show on the Xbox is running the show on the zune. If so, that bodes well for a lot of people. The first gen xbox was crap, but if you had half a brain you could mod it, chip it, and trick it out into what xbox 360 is now. Actually, better (minus the whole hd thing). I have an gen-1 xbox sitting on my mantle w/every emulator, every game, my entire music catalogue, pictures, yada yada plus the ability to stream from my comp to my tv via XBMC. That's the beauty of something as ubiquitous as M$...everybody has a crack at it, everyone uses it, so we get to partake in all of the wonderful hacks people provide for it.

That's basically my point. These wireless features aren't built for us Matlock-loving blog-reading lame @$$e$...it's made for people who *dont own an mp3 player yet*. That's high school, college, young people in general...who do, in fact, get together and do this thing called "hang out". That's lost on a lot of us whose first response to sharing music is "why would I want to share music on the subway?" You wouldn't, idiot.

When the haxzorz get a hold of this puppy and start stripping of the M$-b$...I'll be all about it. I've never been a fan of the ipod, but I know I am in the crazy minority w/that. The click wheel is retarded, itunes is seemingly incompatible w/windows, and their service is spotty at best (I've made many a call for my younger brother). Its definitely bulkier, but apparently it weighs less according to gizmodo. Does that cancel out the bulkiness? Remains to be seen. All I know is, this wifi WILL GET CRACKED...it's not a matter of "if," only "when." Plus competition is good for everyone. The last few ipod updates have been a joke.

[Johnny5 @ Oct 4th 2006 8:24AM]

I agree fully - i threw up a little piece arguing about how else microsoft could leverage the wifi. A unique feature that i think would actually differentiate the Zune is "iPod jacking 2.0". You're basically taking the idea of trading an ipod with a friend to the next level.

http://technolust.typepad.com/technolust/2006/10/enough_with_the.html

[mrfalcon @ Oct 4th 2006 5:35PM]

You used to be able to sync pocketpc's over wifi. Then, just as wifi was becoming a standard feature in ppc's, MS removed the feature from the new version of activesync (the only one that works with WM5 devices) and haven't put it back yet!

So don't buy a Zune with the assumption that MS will add more wifi features. There are lots of people clamoring to be able to sync their ppc's over wifi, but MS won't let them.

[mark @ Oct 4th 2006 10:25PM]

if it only had a voice recorder ... record lectures at school and send them to ppl nearby...

[Kitsune Warlock @ Oct 5th 2006 1:03PM]

"What about indie music"

Man, what about foreign songs. I can't find any of my songs on (United States) i-tunes (Gackt, ORANGE RANGE, etc...) with very few exceptions.

[Chris Griffin @ Oct 6th 2006 11:01AM]

The Zune is probably the best thing that will ever happen to the iPod. Now that there *might* actually be some competition, Apple will improve the iPod at a quicker pace than ever before, and I'm willing to bet that the Apple is working on wireless functionality already.

Every music player to date has tried the "out-feature" method and has been unsuccessful. The only thing Microsoft can do is cannibalize the market by offering this thing at a loss and hope that it will eventually catch on, like they are doing with the Xbox. But this will only work if the Zune is unique in its own way and has some useful things that the iPod doesn't offer......which obviously isn't the case yet. Another music player for the overflowing deadpool if you ask me.

[K Hocke @ Oct 6th 2006 12:05PM]

Just wait until the first Zune virus is released and wirelessly infects every other Zune within range. And so on and so on.....

[SuperMatt @ Oct 6th 2006 1:21PM]

Microsoft's methods as I see them:

1. Announce a product, tout its amazing features.
2. Release date approaches; admit that 3/4 of those features aren't there.
3. Tell everybody that those features will be available "soon" after release.
4. Repeat the same on the next "version" of the product.

SuperMatt

[nighthawkz6 @ Jan 27th 2007 2:23AM]

why the hell would hackers want to spend their time infecting other zunes? They're working on rockbox/linux and have no time to spread this virus b.s. on a cool device, which I personally own. Hackers don't really hack things like these and then spread viruses. They do it on a more open-source thing like a network which the zune is not. Microsoft is going to have games for this in 2008. They're going to be doing firmware updates that will be taking full or at least most of the wi-fi capabilities. The reason why MS couldn't complete the Zune was because they wanted to rush it. So far firmware are looking up to hopes. They have release firmware fixing performance issues and I think they're smart on that. First get to the inside, then get to the outside stuff like Wi-Fi. They are smart. And with all the processing power the zune has(400mghz)Rockbox/Linux will make it compatible to watch DivX/XviD files. I have high hopes for the Zune.

[mattjobs @ Oct 8th 2006 1:04AM]

if u rip the CD you can send it to friends DRM free.

[bluey_02 @ Oct 9th 2006 9:01AM]

Everything that's been mentioned, wireless transfer of songs, podcasts, and more that Microsoft could impliment sounds really good, so good it could even lay the smackdown on the ipod, that is, until the 6G comes out.. Anyway, this seems to have huge potential and only a small part of it seems to be being utilised by MS, so bring on rockbox is all I say.

[Mathue @ Nov 3rd 2006 5:03PM]

I wonder how secure it's WIFi music trade is? And for that matter, what is a Zune running on? A variation of WinMoblie?

[BillyV @ Nov 7th 2006 11:38PM]

Heh...I am totally getting a Zune, cause I know someone will hack it, put a new OS on it, make it into a pocket PC, and put the steps online.

Beats the near $1k price for a pocket PC, plus I'd be doing all kinds of neat stuff!

[mahin @ Jan 18th 2007 9:43AM]

man ive got a zune and sure hope that there would b 1day the wireless internet function.but still this is so cool it totally kicks ipod ass

[MELPOMENE @ Mar 15th 2007 6:13PM]

MSFT totally has botched this. Why are you buying a wifi radio that is hobbled by the gremlins in Redmond? I know! they are smarter than you.

[sliver1978 @ Aug 27th 2007 12:00PM]

Microsoft is actually in a very good position with the Zune. The product is not flawless but it works and is competitive. I believe the I-pod will lose a large portion of market share after microsoft vista gains more market saturation. Currently I-tunes does not work with vista, and the reason behind this is because apple is holding out in effort to encourage people to make the jump to OSX. Bottom line If your running a windows machine an I-pod is probably not a good choice. If your a XP hold out you might be ok for a while. Zune is the best choice for the mass market using windows OS. I will be waiting for the next gen Zune player to be released and hope that we see full featured wi-fi soon.

[Deathblooms @ Nov 13th 2007 10:19AM]

its no longer worthless cus the new firmware is out wireless sync!!!

[kristie @ Mar 12th 2008 2:04PM]

I have a question, I think my son stole someone's zune and it has over 300 songs on it. I want to return it to the owner and when I called microsft they forwarded me to the zune dept customer service and said they couldn't help me because it wasn't registered. I have a serial number, mac something number SSID name. Am I at a lost cause trying to find this owner?? I have wireless internet can I get anything from that. Thank you for your help.